Marvel’s Avengers is Ending Development – Kinda Funny Games Daily 01.23.23
It’s a Greg news day! Let’s talk the end of Marvel’s Avengers, WWE 2K23, and Forspoken reviews.
Time Stamps:
00:00:00 – Start
00:02:14 – Housekeeping
Our episode 2 review of The Last of Us HBO is up right now! Youtube.com/KindaFunny
Our Forspoken Review is up as a new episode of PSILY!
The Roper Report –
00:04:57 – Final Update on the Future of Marvel’s Avengers
00:29:36 – Forspoken Review Round Up
00:41:12 – WWE 2K23 has been officially confirmed for a March release
00:48:40 – 343 Industries Will Continue to Develop Halo ‘Now and in the Future’
00:54:45 – Cyberpunk 2077’s Phantom Liberty Expansion Cost More to Make Than The Witcher 3’s DLC
00:59:52 – Out today
01:01:10 – You‘re Wrong
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There was no adequate gameplay loop. It's easier to gameplay loop fps. Same with indes, you just make it rogue like and it establishes itself. Look back at the older. The true gameplay loop for third person games has always been just a good single player game. They then incorporate multiplayer. That should have been the approach.
All the things cancelled from Avengers;
Kree Invasion Story Expansion
Captain Marvel
She-Hulk
War Machine
Spider-Man on Xbox & PC
Ultron boss
When I found our suicide squad was gunna be like Avengers, my hype went straight to 0. I'm not picking it up anymore. They should've just kept it as a borderlands style co-op multi-player game. Super disappointing.
Marvels Avengers
Pretty good single player game
Fantastic 3d brawler
Terrible live service game
Edit: where this went wrong is obvious. Midway through development they changed this single player game into a live service. You can't build a multiplayer live service game on a single player game engine.
i'm bummed tbh, i just got bucky and lady thor to 150. i'm the same as greg on this, outside of star wars the old republic, this is my most played multiplayer game by a huge margin
Greg always tees up the Avenger jokes so well.
feels like the only way Forspoken isn’t completely forgotten is if it has a Days Gone situation where a small group very loudly is mad that people didn’t like it
What got me was how similar the enemies and missions were in Avengers. It was disappointing.
I love Avengers for what it is. I've put 160+ hours into it, have almost everyone at max level/max gear score, and was looking forward to new content…but at the end of the day I think this was just a bad situation all around. Crystal is a great dev, but wrong for a project of this scale/scope. They clearly never had the freedom to do what they wanted, the budget to create bigger or more content, the pipeline to create that content at a steady pace, or the amount of people needed to build that content. Couple that with Square-Enix's always incredibly lofty sales goals, Marvel Games' reportedly super rigid guidelines and what devs can and can't do, and both demanding a kind of game that the team was ill-equipped to build…and it's just a recipe for bad times.
And for the record, a live-service Avengers game is a legit great idea that could still work, it just has to be done right.
everyone wanted the avengers game to be shut down 3 months after it came out when the game dipped down to only triple digit users. From Feb 2022 – September 2022 there were barely 300 people playing except for one month when there was 500. Game wasn't fun, everything was a punching bag, focused only on Live service. R.I.P. you won't be missed.
I just wish the mc of Forspoken had some black women writers.
This may be the last time I skip an Avengers news story… Wow
RIP Marvel’s Avengers 🫡
no she-hulk sadly. now lets get marvel overwatch what are we doing
Wathcing your videos makes me happy
If you didn’t like forspoken why did you finish it Greg?
I hope insomniac gets the rights to make a great Avengers game in the future
Krizia bajos was cast as she hulk but I guess all those plans are cancelled now
I think it's we got a new modern Hulk game like incredible hulk ultimate destruction
Suicide squad kills rocksteady
Are you guys going to play the midnight suns dlc
I hope they make a sequel to the avengers game
The game lost me when we didnt get content with each character. So much dull stuff and couldnt even give us villain sectors. I did plat it. I put 600 hours in. But I am glad its finally going away.
To me, Forspoken had dud written as soon as I found out Luminous was doing. When they were still an internal dev at Square Enix, Creative Business Unit 2 iirc, they developed FFXV, under Tabata. Now Tabata left after the team officially became Luminous, but from playing the demo, I got all the same middling vibes I got the from the full release of XV. Bad dialogue. Bad line delivery. Large, but lifeless world. The combat is better, but that's it. And if I'm being honest, it felt worse as an overall package compared to XV, and the reviews have only cemented the thought for me.
Cyberpunk was my most anticipated game of 2020 and now it's 2023 and I still haven't picked it back up since I quit halfway through a few weeks after launch. I've jumped back into my save after every new patch to see what they changed- and it's never been enough to pull me back in. Still the most disappointing game I've ever played- and granted, I've played worse games- but I'd never bought in or trusted a studio's promises only to be let down so completely before. I still plan on playing it and beating it someday, but probably only after they've released the 'final update' where the game is in its least shitty state possible- which I'm assuming will coincide with Phantom Liberty's launch.
I’ve said this for so long but GAAS titles are the most risky thing publishers can make. I feel like publishers think it’s easy and it’s a sure fire money maker, but the GAAS graveyard is huge. Fans of those games have only so much time and mindshare to play even a handful. We gotta admit that the genre is like the MMO space, there can only be a handful.
I really think publishers need to release other games and not always online titles because there’s too many and it’s too competitive. Single player/co-op games might not have the highest potential of raking the money, but they can still earn a lot.
Upper management didn't design the good awful facial animations, or the awful spiderman move set.
It is possible for devs to do poor quality work.
The problem with Avengers was it being a live service game. I get what they wanted it to be and to make money. But yeah no fuck that. Guardians of the Galaxy was a great game and I wish Avengers did it that way. I hope whoever has the Marvel license can make a reboot of Marvel Ultimate Alliance. Not just Avengers but all of Marvel.
Marvel's avengers will be truly missed….Hopefully we get another Marvel Multi-player game soon
Great coverage guys on all the topics especially the history of Avengers.
Would love a conversation with Gary Whitta on how forspoken has been received as last I checked he had a bit to do with story and such
I just feel like the practices that are put in place that don't work should be obviously bad ideas to the people in that room making that decision. It's baffling to me that the same shitty things are done even though that same kind of thing was dragged just a week ago, and a month before that and a year before that. If you make a game thats really good, people are generally going to want more content from it. Look at a game like Crawl. That game is amazing. Powerhoof made it, it was damn near perfect, made merch around it, then left it alone. Yet you see people on various forums constantly begging the devs to take their money for new content. You don't have to shove shit into peoples faces in order to drive the sale of content. Just make the thing good and everything else will follow.
The made division 2 with the endgame in mind first I was loving Ubisoft then but that was then
Is the Callisto protocol a better game or the same enjoyment
hopefully they add a offline feature to where we can play it without the internet connection. i hate getting cut off in the middle of a game sometimes while im playing a runthrough.
i really enjoyed Avengers' single player campaign with Kamala's origin story, right up until all the live service stuff was introduced further into the experience with the war table structure sending us off on repetitive missions pulled from the multiplayer side of things, when without Square-Enix wanting a live service, it could have been something great like the Arkham series, Spider-Man or Guardians of the Galaxy.
Best wwf/wwe album is wwf aggression
what CDPR got right with Cyberpunk, they got really right, but for someone who followed the development of 2077 since the beginning, the game has had its fair share of updates, but so much of the game is still missing, i assume scrapped as the game pivoted from tabletop-inspired immersive-RPG to the action-RPG Johnny Silverhand show at some point.
if the new DLC expansion adds NPC's that aren't dead-eyed looping zombies, a city you can actually interact with outside of quest lines, vehicles that aren't on rails & constantly spawning and despawning and the alleged cop system that's still not in the game, not to mention the non-existent branching story lines for each character's life path and more – for me, only then will it have its "No Man's Sky" moment. i wish them luck, i'd love to see it.
Remember how Disney ended their relationship with the Marvel Heroes developers, causing that game to end not long after making its console debut, and clearly it was because they were going all in on this game?
It's also wild to me that Avengers came out the same year as Final Fantasy VII Remake, because that game demonstrated that you can do a really great single player game based around having a party that you can switch controls to on the fly during gameplay, and not just Avengers, but also Guardians of the Galaxy (which is great regardless) and Gotham Knights went with you only being able to control one character, with at most, optional multiplayer. Thankfully, Suicide Squad was confirmed as having a character switching feature in single player.
I'm upset Greg didn't immediately start the show with a eulogy for Avengers. "Friends. We are gathered here today to mourn our favorite game…"
Avengers had all the potential to be a GotY candidate, just executed terribly. The single player story and combat was great but the gaas model failed. And can we stop pretending that Guardians game was good? Decent story but overall was trash
no way barret lasts 3 MINUTES at a real job
I think if we already had an awesome single player Avengers game when this was announced, people would have been more open to the idea. Games as a service isn’t a good first foot forward for an IP. Especially a story and character driven IP.
Nothing about CD making Avengers spurned excitement when they announced that. Even before the live service part, they were a horrible fit coming off TR. There was no overlap that gave hints that it would turn out well.
"You should want these types of games."
Nah, I'm okay with playing games that end. Infinite playability is not inherently positive.
Can I just say this is another Square dud. I can’t see why people have any faith in Square anymore.
Greg are you quitting WWE and boycotting WWE 2k23 due to vince mcmahon paying millions of dollars in rape and sexual harassment lawsuits????
Will the Marvel avengers dlcs be given away for free?, will I be able to play with Black Panther and the rest of the recently released heroes?
I understand what you guys are saying, and how we as gamers like single player Contant but you gotta see where the money is. Games as a service generates so much more money than a single player doing that’s what these companies are going to push for. Investors are going to continually look at what’s making the most money in industry For the least amount of money to produce, and they see its games as a service. First you have to understand it’s getting increasingly more difficult to just make a single player game that hits sales targets. I know some companies are pushing for higher sales targets then they should but even then it’s getting increasingly difficult to make a single player game that is generating enough profit to make the venture worthwhile. Now I know you can point out exceptions, but notice those exceptions come from AAA studios and they have lots of money and talent behind them. Sony for instants they put money and talent behind their single player titles and they use the single player titles to draw people to a gaming platform. There’s a reason they’re developing these narratives it’s not just to make money off of them it’s to bring in a consumer base that consumer base, of course, brings in more consumers because people go where the gamers are. You know the non-gamer crowd who just buys a system to play a few games a year they look where is everybody else going? That’s where I’ll go. where are my friends going? That’s where I will go. Sony knows this that’s why they continually develop single player experiences that people flock to. That’s why they continue to push for third-party relationships with unique single player experiences that draw in customers. Now you can look at someone like the makers of Elden Ring their name escapes me right now, but AAA studio lots of money behind their game lots of financial backing, and they have time to make what they want to make. Totally different from the environment out there for most developers. Usually don’t get time like that if you need it usually they tell you your game needs to be ready by a certain date. Forspoken should be a perfect example of those to everyone that game need it to be ready by a certain date that game did not have a huge budget behind it. Guess what happened? They thought if we put this game out now it’s going to flop let’s try something let’s put out a demo. Let’s push back the release see if we can create some hype here. Didn’t work. Some people played the game on demo and said I can play this. I can get with this and will purchase it as a result but as you guys have seen from reviewing it, the game was lacking many features that a triple a title should have. There is an argument to be made. Is it becoming increasingly unattainable to create AAA titles? Should they go instead to double a titles but of course, that presents its own problems we don’t really purchase AA titles anymore. Remember there was a time when we would’ve taken a game like aforspoken for what it was played it and loved it. Our standards have changed now though go back to the old PS2 days we played games that weren’t great. They were just OK but we didn’t have access to what we have today now if your game is not a 9.0 or better there are some people who won’t touch it. Again creating that problem for developers to make a AAA game that’s going to be 9.0 or better cost a ton of money so instead if we’re going to invest all this money in a game where you should go games as a service route. They see the writing on the wall. They see their competitors collecting money hand over fist. It’s really hard to look at Fortnite for those guys And literally see someone create a costume that might take 30 minutes to make 30 minutes to test in game. It might cost $.30 worth of development money make millions not hundreds of thousands but millions of dollars. You can’t blame them for looking at that and going I want that. In other words, if we want to see more single player content that measures up instead of games as a service all the time we that’s consumers need to support the single player Contant that is really good and maybe even some of the single player content that’s great. If a game gets an eight pointer, you should buy it if it’s your thing, don’t be afraid to buy a game that’s an eight point now don’t be afraid to buy a game that’s a 7.0 not everything can be GOW but it still can be fun. Forspiken got a 6 I will be the first to admit if this games comes to Xbox and I see it for $30. I’ll buy it. Then when I buy I’ll probably play it and finish it. In fact, this is a great game to put in a subscription service guys. It didn’t work out. Let’s let everyone play it you take a few dollars to help recoup your losses try again next time. This is a case where I would love for Sony to say to.Square hey guys, it doesn’t look like this is going to work out let’s get together with Microsoft in a room put this out for the subscribers. Let them play it will both give you some money to recoup your losses maybe even turn a little bit of a profit they get to play something new shiny, maybe it’s not the best new shiny thing but it’s new and shiny you guys go try something else I wish the big three would do something like that for them. That way they will continue to try to make experiences like this because this is what we want to see new AAA titles. This one didn’t work out but another one might.
People "hated on" John Cena and Roman Reigns because at similar points in their careers, they were constantly taken priorty over other younger talent and both forced/constantly pushed beyond anyone else deserving on the roster. They were both burial machines and the audience rightfully reacted negatively to that.